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PLEASE READ: Do NOT worry about Apps running in the Background
- Thread starter cereal killer
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Just what is your point?
Doing what it's supposed to do, theoretically.
Doing exactly what it's supposed to do, checking for new emails on a regular basis. Of course that takes resources. The alternative is to not take resources, but then you don't get email. Your choice, not an OS issue.
No. Only one which are actually doing something. And if you don't want them doing whatever they do, why are you running them in the first place? Your choice, not an OS issue.
Using the provided email app as an example, it can be set to "never" check for email, in which case it only does so when you manually start the application. For your WIFI theoretical, just disable WIFI. Your choice, not an OS issue.
Those apps which consume resources in the background can (always? usually? depends on how well they're written, it's not an OS issue) either be quit, or configured for how often they wake up to do their deeds.
Don't understand it? Study basic *nix architecture. Do a 'ps aux' on a *nix box, and see how many processes just sit around, waiting to be called upon to provide whatever service they provide.
LOL. You're either confused, or more likely, just don't have a clue how Linux works. If an app is running, it's not idle. If it's idle, it's just sitting there, doing nothing but sitting in RAM, most of which can be reclaimed if needed for something else.
An app uses resources whether it's loaded or not. To turn your argument around: Why not uninstall apps from your PC when you're not running them, so they don't consume resources (they consume hard disk space, making the OS work harder tracking file allocations, registry entries, etc.)? It's not whether they consume resources, but whether that consumption has a significant harmful effect (reduces battery life, prevents other apps from running, slows the system down, etc.).
Read up on *nix process states, especially TASK_INTERRUPTABLE (sleep).
Point taken,Mikes. Disk space is a resource,but maybe i haven't stressed my point enough, which is that an app takes up resources that require power to occupy while loaded into memory. You seem to be well informed, so you should understand that data can sit on a hard disk platter not consuming power.
As much as I could clearly learn from an expert like you from discussing *nix process states, especially TASK_INTERRUPTIBLE (I think that's actually the correct spelling of it), let's focus on the discussion at hand which is whether or not its a waste of time to monitor and manage the processes running on your Droid. My position is still that it is a good practice.
sentient02970
New Member
Wow this thread got active while I was sleeping! I think I may have been misquoted earlier about RAM but no bother. To whomever tried to remove the battery only to find a reboot: I think the droid is programmed (like most phones) to hard reboot on battery removal. If you actually "power down" your system, it should retain processes, but I haven't tested that.
Overall, I'm seeing responses here that mirror my original thought that the actual stable memory state does not use power, but access to that memory or changes DO use power. So even though you think gmail is "stable" it may actually actively doing a refresh to the google servers which would use power. The same could likely be said for many of the apps running in the background on your droid. PROBABLY a reason to do some "housecleaning" on occasion. But I have yet to know if it makes any measurable difference.
Like someone asked earlier, I would really like to see some technical specs behind battery use management...unless, of course, it's Moto-classified.
Overall, I'm seeing responses here that mirror my original thought that the actual stable memory state does not use power, but access to that memory or changes DO use power. So even though you think gmail is "stable" it may actually actively doing a refresh to the google servers which would use power. The same could likely be said for many of the apps running in the background on your droid. PROBABLY a reason to do some "housecleaning" on occasion. But I have yet to know if it makes any measurable difference.
Like someone asked earlier, I would really like to see some technical specs behind battery use management...unless, of course, it's Moto-classified.
Once, again, you ignore facts. That is simply not true. If the app weren't in RAM, then that area of RAM would not be used. As has already been pointed out, and which you've obviously ignored, RAM doesn't draw more (or less) power based on its contents. Sure, the app is in a device which draws power. The devices draws exactly the same amount of power when the app isn't loaded. The small number of cycles spent due to additional memory management (dealing with one more memory block out of probably hundreds) isn't enough to make any noticeable difference in speed or battery life.
Where can I buy one of these hard disks which doesn't consume power?
Thank you for conceding that. This was my point all along. The machine does spend cycles managing memory occupied by a loaded program. Therefore, a program loaded into memory does use more resources (that consume power while being occupied - i.e. system bus, processor, memory transistors, etc...) than a program not loaded into memory.
You haven't seen these types of drives? They're pretty cool. They store data even when the power is off! Believe it or not, they even continue to hold their data if you completely remove them from the PC! I've even heard you can take one of these out of one PC and put it in another PC and read data off it! If you want, I'll be glad to make you a deal on a fancy 500MB drive that uses this persistent storage technology. Because I like you, I'll let you buy it for $500. That's a mere $1 per MB. Its made by a company called "Seagate" - they clearly must have a time machine or have made contact with aliens to have such advanced tech.
That's it???? That's your point???
I said that when I first jumped into this thread - http://www.droidforums.net/forum/dr...ut-apps-running-background-20.html#post143122
To a pedant, yes. But if someone is concerned about how fast their Droid runs, or how long the battery lasts, the difference is meaningless. Even then, as stated in the very first post, "Killing off some of the processes you are killing off also means it'll slow your phone down, as these processes only need to reload." So, whatever insignificant amount of battery you gain by closing an app which goes idle, you more than lose when it needs to be loaded from flash into RAM and started up again.
(pedant? that's an awful big word for a confused and clueless rube like me to understand )
Mike, my assertion at the beginning of this and now at the end is to say that more processes in memory = more power being used. You've agreed with me that this is true, although you think its not significant. That may be true for one well written program, but you have no ability to forecast how that scales with hundreds of processes and various levels of quality in the code running those processes.
Regardless of how you think computers work, monitoring and managing these processes is a good practice. Even if you don't believe that they're using any power, you can't disagree that it is good to know what's running. The only way to know if you have unnecessary processes running is to look at the ps list.
I agree with the OP that continuously killing a process that will only restart itself is a futile exercise, but you can uninstall that app if it is always running and you never or rarely use it.
Anyway, how about that HDD offer I made you? I'll drop the price to $450 and throw in something called a floppy disc. It also holds data without using power - AND it makes a good drink coaster...supercool! :icon_ lala:
Incidentally, the DAY after I posted this, I checked my phone around noon and saw that it had 40% battery left, incredibly abnormally low for my usage. I went straight to battery usage and saw PDAnet at 70% (comparatively, the screen, which is my typical main burner, was at 7%!). Running services didn't show it running, but it was apparently sucking my battery dry despite me ending it the day before. I ended up uninstalling it, and reinstalling it. So far, that issue hasn't come back.
But I do understand the point about the current Android OS is well equipped to deal with battery usage.
Not worrying about background apps is all and dandy until you forget to shut down your kill the music player that has been running and it ends up playing music loudly right in the middle of an important meeting while your phone sits untouched on the table in front of you. Can you say 4 shades of red and glaring look from the client.:reddroid:
I'd take that up with the PDAnet people myself.. It should be better behaved than that, if it's not connected to a PC it should be using essentially no resources.
I've since updated the OP....changes are below:
1/16/2010 edit: Since this posting. I reinstalled the ATK for testing purposes in December. I immediately ran into a problem with lock-ups when on long calls. I searched the internet for info and found that others were experiencing this same thing. I realized that the only thing I changed was installing the ATK. Upon uninstall the problem went away. I'm posting a link to the thread where one of our members, hacku, experienced the same issue and I assisted him. If you are new reader to this post or perhaps have noticed this problem on your device I suggest uninstalling the ATK. It will fix the proximity sensor/call issue.
http://www.droidforums.net/forum/te...ggestions/15994-proximity-sensor-problem.html
1/16/2010 edit: Since this posting. I reinstalled the ATK for testing purposes in December. I immediately ran into a problem with lock-ups when on long calls. I searched the internet for info and found that others were experiencing this same thing. I realized that the only thing I changed was installing the ATK. Upon uninstall the problem went away. I'm posting a link to the thread where one of our members, hacku, experienced the same issue and I assisted him. If you are new reader to this post or perhaps have noticed this problem on your device I suggest uninstalling the ATK. It will fix the proximity sensor/call issue.
http://www.droidforums.net/forum/te...ggestions/15994-proximity-sensor-problem.html
Thanks for the update! I had a wierd problem where my shortcuts wouldn't launch when I uninstalled ATK, weird enough as soon as I installed it and used it to clear memory it was fine again. I'm going to uninstall it to see if it changes anything. I haven't really been using it so might as well uninstall it.
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