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Tethering - Here's why I wouldn't do it...

anyone have any butter?

I just grabbed myself a Coke and a bag of Skittles. Watching people argue over misinformation is kind of fun...

Not that I'm saying all of this is misinformation, but so much of it is. Between the 5gb limits for data on the phone, termination of contract for rooting, and the idea that the cable company can magically override NAT and my router security to see which of my two PS3s is causing network traffic.

This thread should probably be closed.
 
Lets keep it simple. We all know that tethering isnt allowed; we do not go into verizon telling everybody and the rep that "my droid can tether for free".
I asked about the palm pre plus and I was told it was a one time promotion to get people to buy; that new palm customers will have to pay to tether.
I just feel it is ridiculous to have to pay an extra 30 bucks a month to go to the same sites that I can go on my phone. So I am basically being gouged just so I can view sites on a bigger screen. I think that is ridiculous.
With that said, like so many have noted, if they wanted to go after tethering they would not have the time to look at every vzw user. They would go after those with crazy usage.
What all this mean to me: Simple if I tether, which I do with my netbook, I go to sites that I can pull up on my droid, I do not use it everyday or as my sole source of internet, and I do not use it to download movies. Besides even though the 3g net is pretty fast, I would rather download the movie through my cable modem since it is faster.
I look at it like this: we all know speeding is illegal and if a cop catch you going one mile over the speed limit he can write you a ticket. If you are driving with the flow of traffic going about five over the speed limit (unless you are in a school zone) a cop is not going to stop you. If you are blowing by the pack and it is clear you are doing at least 15 to 20 over he is going to pop you.
 
the idea that the cable company can magically override NAT and my router security to see which of my two PS3s is causing network traffic.

on a normal/store bought/home-made router there is no way (legally) they can see anything behind the router nor can they access the router in any manner.

IF IT IS A ROUTER YOUR ISP GAVE YOU then hell yes they can access it. most if not all of the residential stuff has the modem built in as well. they dial into that thing all day long.
 
You're focused on the contract and abuse of the network. We're talking about what verizon can determine. If you tether without using a lot of data, is it their policy and practice to track people down? How do they do it? Would a proxy/encryption prevent this? The contract is just a piece of paper. I think we're trying to figure out what Verizon does in practice.

I can only conclude you have very little experience with the legal system if you believe "a contract is just a piece of paper." On the other hand, when this issue has come up in the past on this board I've noted that Verizon would be crazy to try to track down the occasional "tetherer" even if they could.

In the first place, as already noted, they don't have to "prove" that you are tethering your Droid; they only need to decide (not prove) that you are materially affecting other users. And downloading massive amounts of data fits that criterion nicely.

In the second place, VZW isn't concerned with tethering per se. They're concerned with demand on their 3G network that tethering may encourage. To that end, it's far more cost effective simply to examine the amount of data traffic on their 3G network than to examine how that traffic is triggered.

If, in fact, VZW has begun to look more closely at the issue of "tethering," they will simply look at accounts where large volumes of data are being consumed. The first step undoubtedly would be to remind a user of their contract provisions. The second would be to place additional charges on the monthly bill. The third would be termination of service and a black mark on the customer's credit. Problem solved from VZW's point of view.

I can conclude that you have a one-track mind. Nobody cares about the contract that you're an expert on. We know that Verizon doesn't have to prove anything.

Where have you gotten your information that Verizon is only concerned with bandwidth and does not analyze traffic??????? The original poster says that they're going to start cracking down on it. It's up to you to ignore it if you want but do you have one shred of evidence to back up your position?
 
Where have you gotten your information that Verizon is only concerned with bandwidth and does not analyze traffic??????? The original poster says that they're going to start cracking down on it. It's up to you to ignore it if you want but do you have one shred of evidence to back up your position?

Simple logic. If Verizon doesn't need traffic information to accomplish their objectives (i.e. controlling network demand and making heavy users pay for their use), why would they go to the considerable effort and expense to collect it?

Verizon knows what we all know; that tethering is a means to an end, not an end in itself. They can catch heavy users simply by analyzing volume and declaring that it is accomplished by tethering. Since tethering is prohibited but volume is "unlmited," it provides Verizon a way to accomplish their objective of controlling network traffic without risking a PR disaster and forcing you to prove you're not tethering the device.
 
Sorry for the dumb question, but what is tethering?

See post 57 that refers folks to post 53 :)

Take your laptop and use your cellphone as a wireless router to connect to the internet through the cell towers when the power goes out in your house, when you are a passenger in a car, etc and that would be tethering.


I look at it like this: we all know speeding is illegal and if a cop catch you going one mile over the speed limit he can write you a ticket. If you are blowing by the pack and it is clear you are doing at least 15 to 20 over he is going to pop you.

reminds me of a sign I once saw in the clerk's office at the courthouse when I had to pay a speeding ticket long ago: "If you are upset with the fine you have to pay for speeding think of all the times you did not get caught"

I agree....every single tether user will not get nailed on the same day if Verizon decides to start cracking down. The majority of us, if not all of us, will have warning.
 
Where have you gotten your information that Verizon is only concerned with bandwidth and does not analyze traffic??????? The original poster says that they're going to start cracking down on it. It's up to you to ignore it if you want but do you have one shred of evidence to back up your position?

Simple logic. If Verizon doesn't need traffic information to accomplish their objectives (i.e. controlling network demand and making heavy users pay for their use), why would they go to the considerable effort and expense to collect it?

Verizon knows what we all know; that tethering is a means to an end, not an end in itself. They can catch heavy users simply by analyzing volume and declaring that it is accomplished by tethering. Since tethering is prohibited but volume is "unlmited," it provides Verizon a way to accomplish their objective of controlling network traffic without risking a PR disaster and forcing you to prove you're not tethering the device.

They would make an effort because of money.

You're telling us that they are only concerned with heavy bandwidth users--that traffic information is irrelevant. How do you know?

From what people have said, when you get caught tethering Verizon tells you they "know" what you're doing. Legally, they have the right to analyze your data usage. I think they do. You think they don't. How do you know?

If I use my droid to view hi-quality youtube over 3g all day I'll use a lot of bandwidth. The way you're describing it, they'll give me a call and tell me I'm tethering. I don't think so. They'll analyze my traffic to determine what's going on.
 
They would make an effort because of money.

You're telling us that they are only concerned with heavy bandwidth users--that traffic information is irrelevant. How do you know?

From what people have said, when you get caught tethering Verizon tells you they "know" what you're doing. Legally, they have the right to analyze your data usage. I think they do. You think they don't. How do you know?

If I use my droid to view hi-quality youtube over 3g all day I'll use a lot of bandwidth. The way you're describing it, they'll give me a call and tell me I'm tethering. I don't think so. They'll analyze my traffic to determine what's going on.

Oh, please. Somehow I have a feeling you've never been engaged in a major corporate decision of this sort. The tracking of use is, at best, a complex, time consuming effort. On the other hand, tracking of volume requires an sql query that requires about 10 seconds to write and virtually nothing to run.

And if Verizon did track websites visited, data downloaded, etc. I'm sure their attorneys would advise them that they would have to divulge the details of such efforts in any court cases that were brought as a result. I can just see the PR disaster that would involve.

The bottom line is that occasional tethering is simply not going to trigger a response from Verizon. Nor for that matter is heavy use unless it reaches a point among enough users to show up in a cost/benefit calculus. If Verizon is talking about to store staff, it may have reached that point. And with the growth in devices accessing the internet it may soon be more than an academic concern.
 
They would make an effort because of money.

You're telling us that they are only concerned with heavy bandwidth users--that traffic information is irrelevant. How do you know?

From what people have said, when you get caught tethering Verizon tells you they "know" what you're doing. Legally, they have the right to analyze your data usage. I think they do. You think they don't. How do you know?

If I use my droid to view hi-quality youtube over 3g all day I'll use a lot of bandwidth. The way you're describing it, they'll give me a call and tell me I'm tethering. I don't think so. They'll analyze my traffic to determine what's going on.

Oh, please. Somehow I have a feeling you've never been engaged in a major corporate decision of this sort. The tracking of use is, at best, a complex, time consuming effort. On the other hand, tracking of volume requires an sql query that requires about 10 seconds to write and virtually nothing to run.

And if Verizon did track websites visited, data downloaded, etc. I'm sure their attorneys would advise them that they would have to divulge the details of such efforts in any court cases that were brought as a result. I can just see the PR disaster that would involve.

The bottom line is that occasional tethering is simply not going to trigger a response from Verizon. Nor for that matter is heavy use unless it reaches a point among enough users to show up in a cost/benefit calculus. If Verizon is talking about to store staff, it may have reached that point. And with the growth in devices accessing the internet it may soon be more than an academic concern.

On a personal note, you continually try to belittle people and it's not becoming. "sigh", "oh please", "you obviously have never"...blah, blah, blah

Furthermore, as far as I'm concerned, you have no idea what you're talking about. You have no clue what Verizon is up to.
 
Now this argument is starting to get ridiculous. Everyone here is shooting opinions; until something happens its speculation. Like stated every one knows the risks. So if you chooose to tether do it at your own risk period. Not saying something will happen, but if it does then you knew the risks. You are more likely to get caught if you eating a lot of bandwith; not saying you will, but you stand out. Take it for what it is worth.
 
Now this argument is starting to get ridiculous. Everyone here is shooting opinions; until something happens its speculation. Like stated every one knows the risks. So if you chooose to tether do it at your own risk period. Not saying something will happen, but if it does then you knew the risks. You are more likely to get caught if you eating a lot of bandwith; not saying you will, but you stand out. Take it for what it is worth.

My opinion is that this discussion has been ridiculous for at least 8 pages.
 
They would make an effort because of money.

You're telling us that they are only concerned with heavy bandwidth users--that traffic information is irrelevant. How do you know?

From what people have said, when you get caught tethering Verizon tells you they "know" what you're doing. Legally, they have the right to analyze your data usage. I think they do. You think they don't. How do you know?

If I use my droid to view hi-quality youtube over 3g all day I'll use a lot of bandwidth. The way you're describing it, they'll give me a call and tell me I'm tethering. I don't think so. They'll analyze my traffic to determine what's going on.

Oh, please. Somehow I have a feeling you've never been engaged in a major corporate decision of this sort. The tracking of use is, at best, a complex, time consuming effort. On the other hand, tracking of volume requires an sql query that requires about 10 seconds to write and virtually nothing to run.

And if Verizon did track websites visited, data downloaded, etc. I'm sure their attorneys would advise them that they would have to divulge the details of such efforts in any court cases that were brought as a result. I can just see the PR disaster that would involve.

The bottom line is that occasional tethering is simply not going to trigger a response from Verizon. Nor for that matter is heavy use unless it reaches a point among enough users to show up in a cost/benefit calculus. If Verizon is talking about to store staff, it may have reached that point. And with the growth in devices accessing the internet it may soon be more than an academic concern.

On a personal note, you continually try to belittle people and it's not becoming. "sigh", "oh please", "you obviously have never"...blah, blah, blah

Furthermore, as far as I'm concerned, you have no idea what you're talking about. You have no clue what Verizon is up to.


More true words could not have been spoken. Fact is... if, any decisions are made or being made to crack down on this. It is not going to be in a meeting in a corporate store as the OP stated took place. It is going to happen at the corporate level.. then training on the matter will be dispersed to district and regional managers, then on to customer service reps, then to store managers to train their teams... then a webnar will be created so all agent locations will be trained on the matter. And somewhere in all of this it would be leaked to the major tech blogs. So people like BGR would have given us geeks a heads up.. and so fourth and so on. So I would not worry and use it on a side of caution.

There is little fact that is ever posted with the exception of the TOS that clearly shows we are in breech of contract by tethering. Like the person I quoted said we will never know what VZW is up to unless you have a seat in the corp. headquarters with the board of directors... and I doubt any one participating in this thread has one of those seats. ;)
 
It is not going to be in a meeting in a corporate store as the OP stated took place.

It is not my intent to argue with everyone on this thread, but I read the OP to mean that the decision wasn't made in the store but that they learned about the corporate decision in the store. I DON'T KNOW.
 
It is not going to be in a meeting in a corporate store as the OP stated took place.

It is not my intent to argue with everyone on this thread, but I read the OP to mean that the decision wasn't made in the store but that they learned about the corporate decision in the store. I DON'T KNOW.


I do not think you are arguing with everyone... you have put out some good information for us to think about. And the OP could have ment just that. But I have checked with a few of my sources and I have not found anything pointing to any crackdown comming. No meetings any any of the stores here in Missouri.
 
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