Android is losing

[glange65]

While I'm new to the hacking and custom ROM world for my Droid...I have to say that I agree with several posters here.

There is WAY too much negativity and animosity towards iPhone users. They made a different choice than you for their own personal reasons. Quite frankly...I agree with many of their reasons.

Many here say iTunes is evil....Let's be honest then about Android Market. It's a half-baked idea that still sucks. You can't sort your search results in meaningful ways, the search function is terrible ( ironic for a google product), the download section includes old crap you deleted, misses apps you just bought and you can't edit the list, so it is a terrible choice for regaining apps after a wipe. Much more evil than iTunes in many respects.

Apple is controlling and evil? Let's be honest about Google then...again...started with good ideas, then leaves them for something else, like a ADD child. EVERYTHING is a half-baked, half-finished product. For example...how can you make a PC browser (Chrome), a bookmark web application (Google Bookmarks) and the stock browser for the android..and yet make all three so they can't talk to each other and share information??? Even Mozilla with Firefox 4 figured that out.

I'm not saying Android and Google are complete disasters...but Apple and the iPhone have great qualities too. At this point..I'd say a combination of the two would be about perfect.

Just a few more points from a newbie to all you out there...
We newbies are here because we want to learn something and do what you experienced hackers do. But I have to say that you make it very difficult and frustrating...here are some friendly suggestions (and I mean these with respect and the wish to improve things for others)
1. Stop bashing and all the negativity. It doesn't help anyone. It's called respect
2. If you wish to help someone with a post, please remember others read your posts as well, hoping to learn a solution too, but we may not know all the lingo, acronyms, and how to accomplish what you suggest. Please make sure to use clear language and include instructions, or link us to someplace that does. I've struggled for hours and days with a problem, searching forum after database after forum, because I can't find a solution that I can understand and follow.
3. For you theming masters...please don't include images of you theme that include widgets and fonts/backgrounds that you don't include in your theme. If you do, then at least tell us up front what the widgets and goodies are. I can't tell you how many theme I've downloaded and installed to be disappointed that my phone doesn't and can't look anything like what I was sold on. You work hard to create something you're proud of...so sell it in it's glory without embellishment.
4. Fro themers and developers...some of you are amazing at including step-by-step installation instructions...and for that I thank you. You can't begin to understand how important it is for us newbies. That is my request of others...each them and ROM seems to have slightly different takes on how to properly install, but some of you don't tell us how when you post a new version or link. We're left to try and figure it out on our own, sometimes getting it wrong and screwing up our phones, only to have to start over after hours of work. The ONLY themes and ROMs that I have successfully installed without issue included instructions.

I thank you much for reading this. I've learned a great deal from some of the posts and members here. I hope one day I can contribute as well.

 

[b-jammin21]

I know one of my friends has an iPhone 4 and quite honestly I was kind of blown away by the stuff he could do with it. Part of it probably has to do with the fact that all the developers are working on one device, but they probably also have more developers too. Both have their strong points, it's too bad they can't be combined for one superphone lol.

Sent from my DROID2 using Tapatalk

Yeah that's exactly why, I think the number of jailbroken iPhones is in the millions, well that's the number that cydia claims.

The amount of rooted android users is a lot less. Plus you have the people that root only for tethering.
But the developer base for the iPhone is much greater.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Could you please provide a source for where you got your information that the amount of rooted android users is a lot less than jailbroken iphones? Does Cydia provide this information? I'm not real familiar with Cydia and what it is exactly.

I'm curious to see the percentage of rooted/jailbroken phones compared to how many have sold for each brand of phone.

 

[WugFresh]

While I'm new to the hacking and custom ROM world for my Droid...I have to say that I agree with several posters here.

There is WAY too much negativity and animosity towards iPhone users. They made a different choice than you for their own personal reasons. Quite frankly...I agree with many of their reasons.

Many here say iTunes is evil....Let's be honest then about Android Market. It's a half-baked idea that still sucks. You can't sort your search results in meaningful ways, the search function is terrible ( ironic for a google product), the download section includes old crap you deleted, misses apps you just bought and you can't edit the list, so it is a terrible choice for regaining apps after a wipe. Much more evil than iTunes in many respects.

Apple is controlling and evil? Let's be honest about Google then...again...started with good ideas, then leaves them for something else, like a ADD child. EVERYTHING is a half-baked, half-finished product. For example...how can you make a PC browser (Chrome), a bookmark web application (Google Bookmarks) and the stock browser for the android..and yet make all three so they can't talk to each other and share information??? Even Mozilla with Firefox 4 figured that out.

I'm not saying Android and Google are complete disasters...but Apple and the iPhone have great qualities too. At this point..I'd say a combination of the two would be about perfect.

Just a few more points from a newbie to all you out there...
We newbies are here because we want to learn something and do what you experienced hackers do. But I have to say that you make it very difficult and frustrating...here are some friendly suggestions (and I mean these with respect and the wish to improve things for others)
1. Stop bashing and all the negativity. It doesn't help anyone. It's called respect
2. If you wish to help someone with a post, please remember others read your posts as well, hoping to learn a solution too, but we may not know all the lingo, acronyms, and how to accomplish what you suggest. Please make sure to use clear language and include instructions, or link us to someplace that does. I've struggled for hours and days with a problem, searching forum after database after forum, because I can't find a solution that I can understand and follow.
3. For you theming masters...please don't include images of you theme that include widgets and fonts/backgrounds that you don't include in your theme. If you do, then at least tell us up front what the widgets and goodies are. I can't tell you how many theme I've downloaded and installed to be disappointed that my phone doesn't and can't look anything like what I was sold on. You work hard to create something you're proud of...so sell it in it's glory without embellishment.
4. Fro themers and developers...some of you are amazing at including step-by-step installation instructions...and for that I thank you. You can't begin to understand how important it is for us newbies. That is my request of others...each them and ROM seems to have slightly different takes on how to properly install, but some of you don't tell us how when you post a new version or link. We're left to try and figure it out on our own, sometimes getting it wrong and screwing up our phones, only to have to start over after hours of work. The ONLY themes and ROMs that I have successfully installed without issue included instructions.

I thank you much for reading this. I've learned a great deal from some of the posts and members here. I hope one day I can contribute as well.

Firstly: Don't talk down about Mozilla, it is hands down the best browser, of course they "figured that out", its an open source project and gets all the best features. Google chrome is "ok"... at least its not ie.

Second: If you wish to not be a newb, then look up things up you don't understand, or, even easier, simply ask for clarification. If I had to define every single word I have ever used when giving a technical response, I would go crazy. But if someone simply said... "thanks... but can you explain what this means: _____?" And I would say, "sure no problem, ... explanation". But expecting all experienced hackers to just preemptively clarify every technical word they use is ridiculous. As someone who is trying to learn new things, its your responsibility to ask questions and hopefully look the basic things up... if you don't even look things up, you can still learn simply by asking questions politely... people are usually more than happy to explain things or at the very least, provide a link to a helpful resource.

Next: Themes are just modified system apps and framework components. The artists assume users know this and display there set up just to show how the theme flows with user apps/widgets. Theme's may also include themed user apps, but in that case it is always clearly defined in the post. If there is no specifications regarding themed user apps, you should assume that you are just getting a themed framework and themed system apps. If the themer's didn't include screenshots with any widgets, then you would be looking at a blank homescreen... or maybe one with a few shortcuts to system apps so that you can see the themed icons.

Next: I can understand where you are coming from regarding seeing mixed directions... but honestly, installing a ROM involves flashing a zip in clockwork:
1. Bootstrap recovery > grant superuser permissions > Ok
2. Reboot recovery
3. Navigate to "install zip from sdcard" with volume keys and select with camera button
4. Navigate to "choose zip from sdcard" with volume keys and select with camera button
5. Navigate to the location of the zip you are trying to flash
6. Select the zip with camera button > Yes.
7. Let it flash, reboot system.

The only variation there ever is, is determining whether or not you need to clear data/cache:

• When ever installing a new ROM, before flashing it; always clear data, cache and dalvik, to ensure no problems. The only time its acceptable not to clear data, is when the ROM you are installing is an update to the one you are previously running and the dev explicitly says that it is OK to just flash and clear data first.
• To ensure no problems when flashing themes, before flashing the zip; clear cache and dalvik for good measure. It will take a little longer to boot back up because the dalvik will have to rebuild, but doing this ensures that your theme will take properly because it will avoid complications if it happens to include a modified services.jar.
• For installing Stock ROMs... like GB, or Froyo after a SBF, I always recommend performing a factory reset (clearing data/cache) after the install... why? Because it greatly reduces the likelihood of complications.

If you follow the above guidelines.. you will never have to rely on a themer or dev to give you instructions on how to flash their zips.

Now... back on topic;
I would really like to see a manufacturer release an android device that has the high-end hardware and polished finished apple offers with their devices. I will never buy an iLame, but if I ever thought about it, it would be purely based on their superior hardware. I know previously in this thread we discussed .dpkg packages which are pretty slick, but still... android will hopefully adopt that in the near future and even if they don't... ROMs like Liberty and CyanogenMod allow that kind of friendly UI modding through their specialized toolboxes... I know that on the technical level this isn't the same thing, but essentially it provides the same benefit to the end user... to the developer... well... no.

Why I like iLame's:

• dpkg packages
• slick hardware

Why I don't like iLame's

• Because they are lame
• Because they start with the letter "i"

I just hope a manufacturer makes an android device that is a little nicer on the hardware end... I know they can't compete with apples engineers.. but they certainly can get closer. I also hope dpkg are adopted. Android will always be #winning because they don't start with "i" and aren't inherently lame. iLame's simply can't win for these reasons.

{{ WugFresh }}

 

[jkhonea]

Wug, come on, please don't start the iLame remarks and such. We get it, you don't like it. But those are the exact things that start pulling threads apart. This one has been doing really well and I would prefer it stay that way. Just because you don't like it does not make it lame or any less of a device.

 

[WugFresh]

Wug, come on, please don't start the iLame remarks and such. We get it, you don't like it. But those are the exact things that start pulling threads apart. This one has been doing really well and I would prefer it stay that way. Just because you don't like it does not make it lame or any less of a device.

I am sorry. It's difficult for me to talk about apple products with out creatively inserting at least one jab. Even if my comment its a compliment to their products or technology.

Why did I call them iLames? Because.... they ARE lame; even in the rare circumstance that the person who buys one happens to be computer savvy... they still must know in the back of their mind that they are rocking the one size fits all, mobile technology for the masses, trendy tech, device. No matter how smart you are, you have to be aware that you are on the "equalizer" device, the.. "we'll take it from here" device.

Lets be clear; I think apple makes quality products, I have personally considered switching back to iPhones for the same reason the OP mentioned. However...

Apple makes me want to barf:
Here is a perfect example of one of the most revolting and obnoxious things about them that when I became aware of, it instantaneously earned their company a lifetime ban of all products in my book:

• They have the sheer audacity, to call their tech support team "Genius's"

I almost agree with them... Statistically, that tech support guy chilling behind "Genius Bar" is probably actually a legitimate genius in comparison to the average apple customer... But realistically, as a computer company.. calling your trained staff "Genius's" is just overly obnoxious and offensive to anyone who has any brain for technology and science.

I went up to their "Genius Bar" and dropped them off a complicated thermodynamics question and told them that if any of them figured it out by the end of the day that I would personally sign up for lifetime tech support. Well need I say more... they obviously didn't figure it out because they are not Genius's... most of them aren't even that bright. It's just that most of their customer base lacks any understanding of technology... so to them... these guys hanging out in apple stores are GENIUS'S!!! WOW, you figured out how to reset my iPod! Thanks bro!

If apple were less obnoxious then I would consider not making fun of them. I will compliment their products... but their marketing campaign is what defines their entire companies success, so its hard not to look at them and see what they have done regarding "dumbing" down the industry.

{{ WugFresh }}

 

[OneTenderRebel]

Wug, come on, please don't start the iLame remarks and such. We get it, you don't like it. But those are the exact things that start pulling threads apart. This one has been doing really well and I would prefer it stay that way. Just because you don't like it does not make it lame or any less of a device.

I am sorry. It's difficult for me to talk about apple products with out creatively inserting at least one jab. Even if my comment its a compliment to their products or technology.

Why did I call them iLames? Because.... they ARE lame; even in the rare circumstance that the person who buys one happens to be computer savvy... they still must know in the back of their mind that they are rocking the one size fits all, mobile technology for the masses, trendy tech, device. No matter how smart you are, you have to be aware that you are on the "equalizer" device, the.. "we'll take it from here" device.

Lets be clear; I think apple makes quality products, I have personally considered switching back to iPhones for the same reason the OP mentioned. However...

Apple makes me want to barf:
Here is a perfect example of one of the most revolting and obnoxious things about them that when I became aware of, it instantaneously earned their company a lifetime ban of all products in my book:

• They have the sheer audacity, to call their tech support team "Genius's"

I almost agree with them... Statistically, that tech support guy is probably actually a genius in comparison to the average apple customer... But realistically, as a computer company.. calling your trained staff "Genius's" is just obnoxious and offensive to anyone with a brain for technology and science.

I went up to their "Genius Bar" and dropped them off a complicated thermodynamics question and told them that I was coming back at the end of the day and if any of them figured it out that I would sign up for lifetime tech support. Well need I say more... they obviously didn't figure it out because they are not Genius's... most of them aren't even that bright. It's just that most of their customer base lacks any understanding of technology... so to them... these guys hanging out in apple stores are GENIUS'S!!! WOW, you figured out how to reset my iPod! Thanks bro!

If apple were less obnoxious then I would consider not making fun of them. I will compliment their products... but their marketing campaign is what defines their entire companies success, so its hard not to look at them and see what they have done regarding "dumbing" down the industry.

{{ WugFresh }}

I still didn't see a valid reason in all of that rambling.

 

[WugFresh]

Wug, come on, please don't start the iLame remarks and such. We get it, you don't like it. But those are the exact things that start pulling threads apart. This one has been doing really well and I would prefer it stay that way. Just because you don't like it does not make it lame or any less of a device.

I am sorry. It's difficult for me to talk about apple products with out creatively inserting at least one jab. Even if my comment its a compliment to their products or technology.

Why did I call them iLames? Because.... they ARE lame; even in the rare circumstance that the person who buys one happens to be computer savvy... they still must know in the back of their mind that they are rocking the one size fits all, mobile technology for the masses, trendy tech, device. No matter how smart you are, you have to be aware that you are on the "equalizer" device, the.. "we'll take it from here" device.

Lets be clear; I think apple makes quality products, I have personally considered switching back to iPhones for the same reason the OP mentioned. However...

Apple makes me want to barf:
Here is a perfect example of one of the most revolting and obnoxious things about them that when I became aware of, it instantaneously earned their company a lifetime ban of all products in my book:

• They have the sheer audacity, to call their tech support team "Genius's"

I almost agree with them... Statistically, that tech support guy is probably actually a genius in comparison to the average apple customer... But realistically, as a computer company.. calling your trained staff "Genius's" is just obnoxious and offensive to anyone with a brain for technology and science.

I went up to their "Genius Bar" and dropped them off a complicated thermodynamics question and told them that I was coming back at the end of the day and if any of them figured it out that I would sign up for lifetime tech support. Well need I say more... they obviously didn't figure it out because they are not Genius's... most of them aren't even that bright. It's just that most of their customer base lacks any understanding of technology... so to them... these guys hanging out in apple stores are GENIUS'S!!! WOW, you figured out how to reset my iPod! Thanks bro!

If apple were less obnoxious then I would consider not making fun of them. I will compliment their products... but their marketing campaign is what defines their entire companies success, so its hard not to look at them and see what they have done regarding "dumbing" down the industry.

{{ WugFresh }}

I still didn't see a valid reason in all of that rambling.

I said that it was difficult for me not to make some sort of negative remark regarding apple products because of my feelings towards their company and image as a whole. You are free to argue that their marketing does not make them lame... but in my opinion, it does... so I call them lame. Like I said.. apple makes quality products, but that does exonerate them from my judgement. If they were less lame, then I wouldn't call them lame. Is that valid?

{{ WugFresh }}

 

[jeffv2]

I too am voicing my opinion, but seriously this needs to stop now. This thread has survived hundreds of post and very few posts have been removed as far as I can remember. Back to the topic at hand.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Jeff, you say when iPhone 5 comes out, your buying it. But you show that your device is a iPhone 4. How are you getting all these upgrades? If you don't ming me asking.

Are you happy with it? Even though it's on 3G and no Data/voice simultaneously?

Thanks

I used a family members upgrade for the iPhone 4 and I'll use my upgrade for the iPhone 5. Which is supposed to be announced in September.

EDIT: and yes to answer your other question I'm very happy with it, overall i was really nervous to make the switch to a virtual keyboard and leave open source but change is good in this case.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[OneTenderRebel]

I am sorry. It's difficult for me to talk about apple products with out creatively inserting at least one jab. Even if my comment its a compliment to their products or technology.

Why did I call them iLames? Because.... they ARE lame; even in the rare circumstance that the person who buys one happens to be computer savvy... they still must know in the back of their mind that they are rocking the one size fits all, mobile technology for the masses, trendy tech, device. No matter how smart you are, you have to be aware that you are on the "equalizer" device, the.. "we'll take it from here" device.

Lets be clear; I think apple makes quality products, I have personally considered switching back to iPhones for the same reason the OP mentioned. However...

Apple makes me want to barf:
Here is a perfect example of one of the most revolting and obnoxious things about them that when I became aware of, it instantaneously earned their company a lifetime ban of all products in my book:

• They have the sheer audacity, to call their tech support team "Genius's"

I almost agree with them... Statistically, that tech support guy is probably actually a genius in comparison to the average apple customer... But realistically, as a computer company.. calling your trained staff "Genius's" is just obnoxious and offensive to anyone with a brain for technology and science.

I went up to their "Genius Bar" and dropped them off a complicated thermodynamics question and told them that I was coming back at the end of the day and if any of them figured it out that I would sign up for lifetime tech support. Well need I say more... they obviously didn't figure it out because they are not Genius's... most of them aren't even that bright. It's just that most of their customer base lacks any understanding of technology... so to them... these guys hanging out in apple stores are GENIUS'S!!! WOW, you figured out how to reset my iPod! Thanks bro!

If apple were less obnoxious then I would consider not making fun of them. I will compliment their products... but their marketing campaign is what defines their entire companies success, so its hard not to look at them and see what they have done regarding "dumbing" down the industry.

{{ WugFresh }}

I still didn't see a valid reason in all of that rambling.

I said that it was difficult for me not to make some remark regarding apple products because of my feelings towards their company and image. You are free to argue that their marketing does not make them lame... but in my opinion they are.. so I call them lame. That is my reasoning. Like I said.. apple makes quality products, but that does exonerate them from my remarks. If they were less lame, then I wouldn't call them lame. That is my reasoning. Is that valid?

{{ WugFresh }}

Not in the slightest but you are entitled to your own opinion and I will respect that.

 

[jeffv2]

I know one of my friends has an iPhone 4 and quite honestly I was kind of blown away by the stuff he could do with it. Part of it probably has to do with the fact that all the developers are working on one device, but they probably also have more developers too. Both have their strong points, it's too bad they can't be combined for one superphone lol.

Sent from my DROID2 using Tapatalk

Yeah that's exactly why, I think the number of jailbroken iPhones is in the millions, well that's the number that cydia claims.

The amount of rooted android users is a lot less. Plus you have the people that root only for tethering.
But the developer base for the iPhone is much greater.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Could you please provide a source for where you got your information that the amount of rooted android users is a lot less than jailbroken iphones? Does Cydia provide this information? I'm not real familiar with Cydia and what it is exactly.

I'm curious to see the percentage of rooted/jailbroken phones compared to how many have sold for each brand of phone.

I used cyanogenmod's statistics vs cydia's. Of course not everyone uses cyanogenmod but it's the only rom that can give you a idea of rooted users via google statistics. The maker of cydia (jay Freeman) will often say things on his twitter or blog about the number of cydia users & every jailbroken phone has cydia.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jeffv2]

I am sorry. It's difficult for me to talk about apple products with out creatively inserting at least one jab. Even if my comment its a compliment to their products or technology.

Why did I call them iLames? Because.... they ARE lame; even in the rare circumstance that the person who buys one happens to be computer savvy... they still must know in the back of their mind that they are rocking the one size fits all, mobile technology for the masses, trendy tech, device. No matter how smart you are, you have to be aware that you are on the "equalizer" device, the.. "we'll take it from here" device.

Lets be clear; I think apple makes quality products, I have personally considered switching back to iPhones for the same reason the OP mentioned. However...

Apple makes me want to barf:
Here is a perfect example of one of the most revolting and obnoxious things about them that when I became aware of, it instantaneously earned their company a lifetime ban of all products in my book:

• They have the sheer audacity, to call their tech support team "Genius's"

I almost agree with them... Statistically, that tech support guy is probably actually a genius in comparison to the average apple customer... But realistically, as a computer company.. calling your trained staff "Genius's" is just obnoxious and offensive to anyone with a brain for technology and science.

I went up to their "Genius Bar" and dropped them off a complicated thermodynamics question and told them that I was coming back at the end of the day and if any of them figured it out that I would sign up for lifetime tech support. Well need I say more... they obviously didn't figure it out because they are not Genius's... most of them aren't even that bright. It's just that most of their customer base lacks any understanding of technology... so to them... these guys hanging out in apple stores are GENIUS'S!!! WOW, you figured out how to reset my iPod! Thanks bro!

If apple were less obnoxious then I would consider not making fun of them. I will compliment their products... but their marketing campaign is what defines their entire companies success, so its hard not to look at them and see what they have done regarding "dumbing" down the industry.

{{ WugFresh }}

I still didn't see a valid reason in all of that rambling.

I said that it was difficult for me not to make some sort of negative remark regarding apple products because of my feelings towards their company and image as a whole. You are free to argue that their marketing does not make them lame... but in my opinion, it does... so I call them lame. Like I said.. apple makes quality products, but that does exonerate them from my judgement. If they were less lame, then I wouldn't call them lame. Is that valid?

{{ WugFresh }}

I agree completely, honestly I'll never buy a Mac or other apple product.
I got the iPhone because everything it has to offer. It just seems like a more linuxy device, you can compile Binaries and crosscompile all from the device... Something android lacks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[manilaboy1vic]

Since when is it "evil" for a company to make a profit?

Sent from my Droid 2 while driving. Thankyou Tapatalk

Its how they do it thats evil. Forcing people to use iTunes is pretty evil... IMO that is.

Ya for the iphone that sucks.. thank God I dont HAVE to use itunes on my macbook pro if i dont want to..

VLC works just fine as a media player

 

[jkhonea]

Eh, I just don't have the huge problem with iTunes everyone else has, I guess. Especially after the DRL situation cleared out.

 

[jeffv2]

Since when is it "evil" for a company to make a profit?

Sent from my Droid 2 while driving. Thankyou Tapatalk

Its how they do it thats evil. Forcing people to use iTunes is pretty evil... IMO that is.

Ya for the iphone that sucks.. thank God I dont HAVE to use itunes on my macbook pro if i dont want to..

VLC works just fine as a media player

iTunes isn't needed to manage the iPhone, with ubuntu and a jailbroken iPhone, ubuntu mounts the entire filesystem. So ubuntu's native music player can be used.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[WugFresh]

I still didn't see a valid reason in all of that rambling.

I said that it was difficult for me not to make some sort of negative remark regarding apple products because of my feelings towards their company and image as a whole. You are free to argue that their marketing does not make them lame... but in my opinion, it does... so I call them lame. Like I said.. apple makes quality products, but that does exonerate them from my judgement. If they were less lame, then I wouldn't call them lame. Is that valid?

{{ WugFresh }}

I agree completely, honestly I'll never buy a Mac or other apple product.
I got the iPhone because everything it has to offer. It just seems like a more linuxy device, you can compile Binaries and crosscompile all from the device... Something android lacks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Am I hearing you correctly? You can compile binaries on the device itself? If that is really true... then I really have no comeback besides my original statement that they are lame. Now I just wish that they weren't so lame so that I could allow myself to buy one.

{{ WugFresh }}