Does the DX2 kernel have unauthorized tether monitor ?

[vvildcard]

Well... this is getting out of hand quickly. You clearly don't understand my point, so I'll just leave you to it. I'll just defend your attacks against me and leave it at that.

I answered your "is there a difference?" Question in my first post. You ignored it.

Actually, I addressed it in my next post:

The state of the 3G connection doesn't matter

Trying to compare usb transferring to tethering is silliness

Silliness? No! They're fundamentally the same thing!

Hopefully you don't own a business where litigation is your first resort when something goes wrong. Easy way to go bankrupt.

I never suggested that VZW should be taking people to court. I'm saying this is a reason why they aren't. Sure, money is an issue, but I assure you they pay the lawyers a retainer that would cover the suit. Regardless, contract disputes usually are taken to arbitration (per the contract) and the loser pays the fees in addition to the awarded settlement.

the reason you won't go to court over this is bc you know you'll lose

No... I'm quite sure I would win if they re-wrote my Unlimited Data contract to a tiered plan without my consent. I generally have no interest in bogging down my life with legal action.

 

[czerdrill]

Well... this is getting out of hand quickly. You clearly don't understand my point, so I'll just leave you to it. I'll just defend your attacks against me and leave it at that.

I answered your "is there a difference?" Question in my first post. You ignored it.

Actually, I addressed it in my next post:

The state of the 3G connection doesn't matter

Silliness? No! They're fundamentally the same thing!

Hopefully you don't own a business where litigation is your first resort when something goes wrong. Easy way to go bankrupt.

I never suggested that VZW should be taking people to court. I'm saying this is a reason why they aren't. Sure, money is an issue, but I assure you they pay the lawyers a retainer that would cover the suit. Regardless, contract disputes usually are taken to arbitration (per the contract) and the loser pays the fees in addition to the awarded settlement.

the reason you won't go to court over this is bc you know you'll lose

No... I'm quite sure I would win if they re-wrote my Unlimited Data contract to a tiered plan without my consent. I generally have no interest in bogging down my life with legal action.

I guess if you refuse to understand something, it makes things difficult or hard to understand...fundamentally. they are not fundamentally or ultimately the same thing. one is transferring files from your phone to your pc without an internet connection, one is sharing your internet connection on your phone to your pc. i'm not trying to be difficult, i just dont see the similarities between the two (probably because there is none). you don't need an internet connection to do the former, you do to do the latter. you aren't transferring files from phone's sd card to pc in the latter, you are in the former. the former isn't against your TOS, the latter is. I dunno...i guess if you want to justify something, there's a million ways to do it.

As for the reason they aren't going to court, again...it's cuz thats an utter waste of money. even if they did win against everyone who illegally tethered, they'd be out of millions of dollars. regardless of if it goes to arbitration or full on litigation, they'd be wasting time and money. the cheap, and quick way to do it is tiers...and they're going to do it. no chance, verizon would EVER go to court for something like that, no matter how much data abuse someone does. that's pure stupidity in every sense of the word.

When (not if) they re-write your contract or tell you you have to change your contract if you want to renew it, they will allow you to opt out. In other words...they can't force you to sign it. So no, you would not win if you take it to court. Why? Because if you refused to sign it, you are free to leave. And if you do sign it...well...you signed it. Feigning ignorance about your contract is not going to work, as much as you'd like it to, buddy, just like saying i'm attacking you, when you asked me if I was afraid of answering your question doesn't work either...

 

[UNC]

Well... this is getting out of hand quickly. You clearly don't understand my point, so I'll just leave you to it. I'll just defend your attacks against me and leave it at that.

I answered your "is there a difference?" Question in my first post. You ignored it.

Actually, I addressed it in my next post:

The state of the 3G connection doesn't matter

Silliness? No! They're fundamentally the same thing!

Hopefully you don't own a business where litigation is your first resort when something goes wrong. Easy way to go bankrupt.

I never suggested that VZW should be taking people to court. I'm saying this is a reason why they aren't. Sure, money is an issue, but I assure you they pay the lawyers a retainer that would cover the suit. Regardless, contract disputes usually are taken to arbitration (per the contract) and the loser pays the fees in addition to the awarded settlement.

the reason you won't go to court over this is bc you know you'll lose

No... I'm quite sure I would win if they re-wrote my Unlimited Data contract to a tiered plan without my consent. I generally have no interest in bogging down my life with legal action.

Transferring via usb something you dl on the phone is NOT fundamentally the same thing.
The way your CPU interacts with the net is different than the way your phone does, so even if the data is the "same", it is handled differently.

Downloading a movie onto your phone and transferring it via USB just isn't practical, but if you wanted to do it there is nothing stopping you. Hooking your CPU up via tethering makes that type of download much more practical, and therefore much more likely. That takes up the bandwidth that everyone pays for. It is actually really damn selfish.

I hope they switch to tiered and all the tetherers go to Sprint. The extra bandwidth will be sweet.

You cannot argue with this fact; You signed up knowing the rules. Period, end of discussion. (Seriously I have nothing else to say)

 

[sampsonX2]

Dumbest bunch of smart people i have ever seen

I'm sorry, but for as smart as all you people are arguing the ETHICAL points back and forth I cant stand it anymore!

ALL YOUR ARGUMENTS ARE INVALID!!!!!

here is the LAW ( I cant believe after this many pages of discussion no one looked up their local theft of services statutes, her is kansas)

"21-3704. Theft of services. (a) Theft of services is obtaining services from another by deception, threat, coercion, stealth, tampering or use of false token or device.(b)  "Services" within the meaning of this section, includes, but is not limited to, labor, professional service, cable television service, public or municipal utility or transportation service, telephone service, lodging, entertainment and the supplying of equipment for use. For purposes of this section, rural water districts and rural electric cooperatives shall be considered public utilities.

(c) "Tampering" within the meaning of this section, includes, but is not limited to:

(1)  Making a connection of any wire, conduit or device, to any service or transmission line owned by a public or municipal utility, or by a cable television service provider;
(2) defacing, puncturing, removing, reversing or altering any meter or any connections, for the purpose of securing unauthorized or unmeasured electricity, natural gas, water, telephone service or cable television service;

(3) preventing any such meters from properly measuring or registering;

(4)  knowingly taking, receiving, using or converting to such person's own use, or the use of another, any electricity, water or natural gas which has not been measured; or any telephone or cable television service which has not been authorized; or

(5) causing, procuring, permitting, aiding or abetting any person to do any of the preceding acts.

The LAW clearly states that getting a service IN ANY WAY that is offered for sale by a utility company OF ANY KIND is theft of services. PERIOD!

THE TERMS AND CONDITIONS ARGUMENT IS INVALID - It is als a matter of CIVIL LAW - and if you want out, pay an attorney to write a letter and send it to VZW stating that they are in breach of contract by denying you use of your wireless tethering in your unlimited data plan, or you will sue them! You go that far and I'm willing to bet that they will let you out of your contract with no fee's.

Do I like it . . . .NO my personal opinion sides with wireless tethering. I believe that the FCC complaint filed by free press is a valid complaint and that the FCC should issue a cease and decist to att, verizon and all others for this CLEAR violation of THEIR terms and conditions agreed to when they appropriated the bandwith from the government. This is ALSO ILLEGAL! and they should be forced to refund all $ that they made by charging people for wireless tether, this should be a madatory requirement set forth by the government. But again THIS IS MY OPINION on the ethics of the situation. I think that wireless tethering is AWESOME!! and I think it should be FREE! And if it weren't for this law I would be wireless tethering all the time. I think that VZW charges too much $ for a data connection that you can only use your phone on and that $29 for 2 gigs is outlandish. I also thing that tiered plans are stupid. As much as I pay for my plan they should be upgrading their data sysems to handle the traffic. And I agree that unlimited means unlimited, but again that is CIVIL law argument and will NOT get out out of theft of services!! END OF DISCUSSION!!!!!

dancedroid:blackdroid:dancedroid

and for fun here are some dancing droids

 

[czerdrill]

^ How are "ALL OUR ARGUMENTS ARE INVALID!!!!!" when there are people who've said the exact thing you just did haha...some of the arguments are invalid but all of them are not.

It's theft of service, plain and simple, whether you like it or not. Unlimited does mean unlimited...for your phone, through your phone. It doesn't mean unlimited tethering, nor was it ever offered as such. The people who argue that are trying to justify something they know would never hold up anywhere. The only reason they do it is because they haven't been stopped by Verizon and there's always been a workaround.

I for one wish VZW would just charge these people for unauthorized tethering. That would provide several pages of comedy gold as people whine and complain about being caught, threaten to sue Verizon, and say they're leaving for Sprint...dancedroid

 

[nlinecomputers]

I haven't read every post here so forgive me if this has already been said. But everyone here talks about how Verizon is evil or greedy and how it is wrong to charge for tethering because data is data and all that right?

Well there are legitimate reasons why Verizon opposes tethering and they have nothing to do with greed. Verizon is a cell phone company, they use cell tower, and cell towers can only make so many connections at once.

Lets say that I have a cell tower that can only connect 100 calls or data connections at the same time. If you are cell phone 101, too bad you are not connecting to this tower. Now even though I can only handle 100 data connections there may be 1000 phones in the area, powered on ready to connect. Now with typical internet usage you open a web page or grab email and then stop. A connection is not needed for you to read the screen. When you stop downloading data the next user can do the same and by the time you are finished reading and ready to grab more data the other user has got off and the node is free again. Music and video complicate that. The bandwidth demands of a PC are often much greater then a phone. The bandwidth demands of several PCs obviously are even that much more. The problem isn't the data. It is the fact that you tie up a node that Verizon is trying to share with 9 other users. THAT the problem from Verizon's end. As bandwidth demands increase all the cell companies are having problems with dropped calls. People not able to connect because the cell tower is full. All the new limits are an effort to control that AND a means to get more revenue that they can turn around in the form of more network and bandwidth capacity. Why the heck is VZW putting up 4g tower to begin with and what do you think pays for that to be installed and built?

 

[lfylove]

I don't always tether but when I do

I use easy tether.

Sent from my Droid using DroidForums

 

[lpulle]

I paid for 3g hotpot for 3/4 months not using it much and I was not impressed--it was slow. I went to a local company for the same price and glad I did. Version just lost 20 dollars. Wish the could set up a reasonable pay as you go.

Sent from my DROID2 using DroidForums

 

[vvildcard]

So much QQ... Thanks for the Los.

Some one tell me how watcwatchiisTube on my phone all day is different from watchispecificall computer all day... More specifically, how does one method place more of a burden on the VZW servers? There are two contradictory arguments getting presented (against tethering) and we should probably get that sorted out.


Sent from my DROID X2 using DroidForums

 

[vvildcard]

Stupid autocorrect... Los = LOLs


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[vvildcard]

Oh my... Something really got messed up in transfer on that one... Too bad my phone app won't let me fix errors.


Sent from my DROID X2 using DroidForums

 

[brad92]

That's hilarious...

random rom'd X

 

[czerdrill]

So much QQ... Thanks for the Los.

Some one tell me how watcwatchiisTube on my phone all day is different from watchispecificall computer all day... More specifically, how does one method place more of a burden on the VZW servers? There are two contradictory arguments getting presented (against tethering) and we should probably get that sorted out.


Sent from my DROID X2 using DroidForums

I think the thing that needs to get sorted out is why people who tether think that the people who dont are saying "data is different if used on a computer"...that's not what anyone is saying. It's not different. Data is data.

The point is if you're on your computer you're going to use more data then if you were on your phone. Why? Because you're going to be visiting more websites, downloading more things, and transferring more data simply because its more convenient. Its actually pretty simple, but people who tether want to turn the argument into "i pay for data and data is data" all the time. That's not what it's about. As much as people want to say "I can do everything on my phone that I can on my computer" the truth is if you have a computer you'll be doing much more.

If you're on a computer, you're going to use more data then if you're on a phone. Not because the same website is going to use more bandwidth, but because you're going to be visiting the same website, and then 20 more...not rocket science.

 

[vvildcard]

I don't buy that for a second. You're saying it's about potential bandwidth that may or may not be used... But I don't get in trouble if I do use more on through my phone. My contract is unlimited so they clearly weren't concerned about the amount of data I could use when I signed up.

Sent from my DROID X2 using DroidForums

 

[czerdrill]

I don't buy that for a second. You're saying it's about potential bandwidth that may or may not be used... But I don't get in trouble if I do use more on through my phone. My contract is unlimited so they clearly weren't concerned about the amount of data I could use when I signed up.

Sent from my DROID X2 using DroidForums

this is contradictory in every sense of the word. You're quoting your contract when it benefits you and ignoring it when it doesn't. The contract says you cant tether either...however its ok to ignore that part right?

and it doesn't matter if you "buy it" or not, its most probably a fact. If it wasn't, why are you bothering to tether anyway? If its no more or no less convenient to use a computer over a phone then why are you tethering?

Cuz data is data? Ok, then would you be ok if Verizon violated your contract and said that the unlimited on your phone, isn't actually unlimited?