A Plan For A Brighter Android Future

[czerdrill]

wait you were being serious nerdslogic? LOL...ok where have you been...?

 

[nerdslogic]

I don't know....I work rotating 12's and am on a 10 day stretch.....plus I have a 2 year old and an 8 month old.....we watch super special tv like Backyardagains....no Android commercials on Nick Jr....

Not to mention I just came off a 36 hour shift....got 6 hours of sleep and I am half way through my 12 hour shift today.

YES....36 hour shift.....contractual agreements and coworkers calling in are to blame.

 

[czerdrill]

well that explains that haha

 

[nerdslogic]

I do believe that Android owners get a bit more credit then deserved but at the same time you know how that super old timeless saying goes....

Android....anything less would be uncivilized

 

[Inverse]

Seriously though~ back on topic, maybe this has been done to death and discussed to death, but I don't like any idea that makes rooted users seem special or criminal or any of these ideologies to make companies happy.

My phone.

Mine. I bought it. Just like my computer, my car~ mine. Network, theirs~ totally their call. Do whatever the hell you want with it. Cap me, slow me down~ whatever, be total cretins when it comes to your network all day.

Rooting? MY perogative. I do what I want with it. Don't want me on your network cuz I rooted? Totally your call~ but don't you dare stop me from doing it on MY device. Maybe I WANT a Wifi only Bionic. Surprise! Mine. Not yours Verizon.

You're already charging the most of any carrier for your data plan. A ridiculously slow wireless network most people have to pay 50 dollars in addition to the 60 dollars you're charging just for the privilege of using their phone, as a phone. This is the cheapest option as well.

This tethered data, is the EXACT same data that is going through my phone. The same. No different. It literally makes NO difference or even taxes Verizon any more to have that data pop up on my 12" netbook or my 3.7" Droid 2 screen. The phone works like a phone. It does what it does, however it does with data I already paid for. Exorbitantly. Even if I had three or four other users on it, the phone will still provide data the same way it always has been able to.

If data use is their concern, like I said~ cap it, slow me down~ allot me bandwidth. Whatever~ but I'm not going to pay more money for data I already paid for. No, I'm not~ it's like charging me money for utensils at a restaurant to eat the food I already ordered. I will switch to whatever carrier doesn't lock me logically, or ethically from devices and services that I am owed based on the money I've already provided.

No~ and I won't have a policy, by a white knight hacker that wants good with a corporation that steals from its consumers under the pretense of justice~ that labels a community that is pushing this platform forward~ that make villains out of developers that have made Android what it is today.

My phone. Their network. They can meet halfway with us when they have better competition and feel the pinch as we give them the finger.

 

[rkeller62]

Well, I've read all 31 pages of this thread so I might as well chime in.

Wug, a couple of things to think about:
1. everything in your plan seems to revolve around VZW and Moto. You need to consider all of the carriers/manufacturers. I am especially talking about your continued talk of a one disk SBF procedure. Only Moto uses SBF files and RSD Software. How will you implement this for HTC or Samsung or LG?
2. It doesn't matter how many people are now rooted, how many would root given your new policies/TOS/$$$? In other words, what will the market bare? Am I willing to pay $10 more per month for the privilege? Maybe. $25? No.

Finally - I will tell you that I am rooted, but have never tethered - it's just to darn slow to be of any use to me. For most of the time that I have been rooted, I have run stock ROM and only rooted to run a faster kernel to squeeze a little more life out of my OG Droid. I would consider myself plenty tech savvy and able to handle any of the procedures necessary to root/load roms/recover with sbf whatever. Personally though, I would not pay more to VZW for the kind of plan that you are talking about. Why?? For the most part I am happy with the manufacturer/carrier delivered software and see no pressing reason to. Is it sometimes fun to play with it? Yes. Would I pay extra to play with it? No. If this policy were in place now would I be rooted? No, I would probably be complaining about how slow my Droid was but I would not pay extra to change it. I might though consider an early upgrade to get something faster.

I wish you luck with your endeavor, but do realize it is a major uphill battle for you.

 

[illmatic636]

Seriously though~ back on topic, maybe this has been done to death and discussed to death, but I don't like any idea that makes rooted users seem ****ing special or criminal or any of these ideologies to make companies happy.

My phone.

Mine. I bought it. Just like my computer, my car~ mine. Network, theirs~ totally their call. Do whatever the hell you want with it. Cap me, slow me down~ whatever, be total cretins when it comes to your network all day.

Rooting? MY perogative. I do what I want with it. Don't want me on your network cuz I rooted? Totally your call~ but don't you dare stop me from doing it on MY device. Maybe I WANT a Wifi only Bionic. Surprise! Mine. Not yours Verizon.

You're already charging the most of any carrier for your data plan. A ridiculously slow wireless network most people have to pay 50 dollars in addition to the 60 dollars you're charging just for the privilege of using their phone, as a phone. This is the cheapest option as well.

This tethered data, is the EXACT same data that is going through my phone. The same. No different. It literally makes NO difference or even taxes Verizon any more to have that data pop up on my 12" netbook or my 3.7" Droid 2 screen. The phone works like a phone. It does what it does, however it does with data I already paid for. Exorbitantly. Even if I had three or four other users on it, the phone will still provide data the same way it always has been able to.

If data use is their concern, like I said~ cap it, slow me down~ allot me bandwidth. Whatever~ but I'm not going to pay more money for data I already paid for. No, I'm not~ it's like charging me money for utensils at a restaurant to eat the food I already ordered. I will switch to whatever carrier doesn't lock me logically, or ethically from devices and services that I am owed based on the money I've already provided.

No~ and I won't have a policy, by a white knight hacker that wants good with a corporation that steals from its consumers under the pretense of justice~ that labels a community that is pushing this platform forward~ that make villains out of developers that have made Android what it is today.

My phone. Their network. They can meet halfway with us when they have better competition and feel the pinch as we give them the finger.

Plus 4++++

 

[OneTenderRebel]

I keep seeing the car comparison. "it's my car I can do what I want so I should be able to do the same with my phone" Umm am I missing something or do car's not have governors? Also go ahead and tint your windows black, see how long it takes before you get pulled over? Yes you can make upgrades to your car but you still have to follow a rulebook. You go outside the rulebook (regardless of how stupid the rules are) you are breaking the laws of whatever rulebook it may be.

 

[nerdslogic]

I keep seeing the car comparison. "it's my car I can do what I want so I should be able to do the same with my phone" Umm am I missing something or do car's not have governors?

Yes....and they also have chips which remove governors....kinda like....well....rooting. I have chipped every BMW I have owned....all 5....chipped and working better than before...kinda like my Droid 2....rooted and working better than before.

 

[bplewis24]

I think people on this forum give android users WAYYYY too much credit lol. They really believe that the majority of android users bought their phone because they did some kind of research...

Exactly.

Look, people would probably consider me an Android fanboy based on how defensive I can be when it comes to Android vs iOS and a lot of the misinformation there is out there. However, I have always maintained that the reason Android overtook iOS is not because it's better (although I believe it is), it's because Verizon and Motorola started to fight back in Apple's main arena: Marketing.

What is the real-world implication of this? It means that more Joe Six Packs own Android devices than geeks do. And it isn't close. Sure, some J6P owners end up rooting, but most don't. They want a "smartphone" that works and for whatever reason, they aren't buying an iPhone. If the phone can browse the web, check their email and allow them to post pics to Facebook easy enough, they are happy with it. I bet there are even some out there that don't fully utilize Android's biggest killer app (Maps Navigation).

I have no idea what the real number of rooted users is. I, too, wish there were a way to track it. I would believe it if somebody told me it was around 3% (which is often a threshold of significance in some industries). You might be able to convince me that it's higher than that. It wouldn't shock me if it hit 5-15% someday in the future as awareness of it's benefits spread. Anything higher than that is a pipe dream, IMO. Actually, that (15%) is my pipe dream. But right now? No way, Jose.

Brandon

 

[nerdslogic]

I don't think we are ever going to know the actual number of rooted users. I would LOVE it if VZW and MOTO embraced....you read right....EMBRACED the rooted community....shoot they could even advertise it as a selling point....Droid does WHATEVER you want....don't like the OS....CHANGE IT....want a different theme....CHANGE IT....don't worry about what iDONT do.

So yeah....that's my pipe dream. What would Apple do if VZW did that? I can tell you.....F...A...I...L

 

[Inverse]

I keep seeing the car comparison. "it's my car I can do what I want so I should be able to do the same with my phone" Umm am I missing something or do car's not have governors? Also go ahead and tint your windows black, see how long it takes before you get pulled over? Yes you can make upgrades to your car but you still have to follow a rulebook. You go outside the rulebook (regardless of how stupid the rules are) you are breaking the laws of whatever rulebook it may be.

We can have this discussion as soon as my automobile manufacturer and dealership tell me what color I can paint my car, which gas station I have to fill up on and tells me I need to pay them extra per month to allow my friends in the backseat.

 

[WugFresh]

@rkeller62
1. Thats a very good point. How do you restore on those phones? Maybe it could be simplified. I am not focusing on Verizon.. but it does seem that with my SBF comments that I have been thinking within the framework of moto.

I had an idea though, since you brought this up. This is something that would undoubtedly cost overhead that I am probably underestimating in my mind. But for theory sake. Hear me out.

What if to restore your device you didn't have to boot into bootloader mode and connect your device to a computer at all. The full system restore file was stored in the internal storage.

As in... what if stock recovery mode was actually clockwork recovery? Or a revised version? And if factory reset was truly a factory reset, not just a data and cache wipe.

The two recovery modes that we have right now is what causes almost all of the problems.

If there was just one recovery mode, that could also be used to flash zips. That would be probably the best thing of all time, regarding making this safe for the end user.

Factory reset should be a true Factory reset (restores all files back to stock...kinda like the SBF update.zip or maderstcok). I can't believe that I just thought of this now. Wow... that would really help these problems.

2. Yes. Al pricing schemes can only be put into effect after market research. All commercial products have gone through some stage of market research to determine pricing, sometimes before the product is even made.

Rkeller, I think you just helped me realize the best idea I have thought of yet regarding the possibility of making this practical and safe.

Only one recovery mode. A combination of clockwork and stock, with built in, full system restore file. Now that right there would change the game up completely. Thanks man.

{{ WugFresh }}

 

[Doulandroid]

But if there's a stable ROM and stock recovery built into the phone, won't that take away the fun of passing out cold from bootloop/ brick anxiety?

Sent from my Droid using DroidForums

 

[nerdslogic]

But if there's a stable ROM and stock recovery built into the phone, won't that take away the fun of passing out cold from bootloop/ brick anxiety?

Sent from my Droid using DroidForums

wouldn't want that.