P3Droid: Some Food for Thought - Bootloaders, Rooting, Manufacturers, and Carriers

[cynnar]

What are your thoughts on how vzw will try to catch root users?

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if they want to do it, they have the right to do it. i dont really care. it sucks, because i love modding my phone, but not a deal breaker for me. my next phone will still be an android regardless of how "open" it is.

Here Here. Yeah I know they have the right, but do you really think it will stop. After all wasn't it Microsoft who said that windows XP could not be pirated. Think it was just a few days it was cracked.

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[cynnar]

Bad example I know.

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[TheTyler0013]

Here is a plain solution. If the dev community feels this way we should STOP tethering. By a disclaimer or having ROMS that only allow official tethering from the phone. I dont know, but its completely unfair that a fat ass tethering hog (the ones out there) ruin it for all of us.


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[czerdrill]

What are your thoughts on how vzw will try to catch root users?

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if they want to do it, they have the right to do it. i dont really care. it sucks, because i love modding my phone, but not a deal breaker for me. my next phone will still be an android regardless of how "open" it is.

Here Here. Yeah I know they have the right, but do you really think it will stop. After all wasn't it Microsoft who said that windows XP could not be pirated. Think it was just a few days it was cracked.

Sent from OG Droid powered by Pete's GPA

No not at all, I'm sure someone will figure out root. I was just saying it wouldn't matter to me either way. I'm not going to base my next phone decision on whether it can be rooted. Nor will I go to the Supreme Court because VZW doesn't want me to root my phone.

The truth of the matter is, I'm not some loyal fan of this p3droid guy and I don't take anything as gold until I hear it from the source. I can put up a site, cite unnamed sources and make up stories too.

 

[czerdrill]

Here is a plain solution. If the dev community feels this way we should STOP tethering. By a disclaimer or having ROMS that only allow official tethering from the phone. I dont know, but its completely unfair that a fat ass tethering hog (the ones out there) ruin it for all of us.


Sent from my ADR6400L using DroidForums

no chance this will ever happen, far too many entitled folks out there...

 

[cynnar]

Most agreed. Only when it happens will we know for sure. And you are right again if vzw says no root or it is jail or huge fine. I choose no root. The phone was great before I had root. Would not like it as much after the faster kernels, but hey I'm due for an upgrade anyway.

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[TheSwaggeR]

It really peeves me that people like czerdrill and hookbill and others go against the argument of others and basically imply "well Verizon and Google are 100% right, we should abide by everything they say and pass on the word that rooting is wrong, customizing your phone is wrong, this and that is wrong and it's in the ToS!"

Kind of stupid you're implying that when the lot of you were and have been doing the exact same thing the rest of us have been doing for awhile. Which includes rooting, any form of customizing, and stuff to improve our phone or battery life. You're on a forum that is and was built for hackers, improvisors, tips and tricks from others, and many other people in those categories. Heck, even the rescue squad relies in areas to, by ways of rooting and other stuff, rescue people's phone.

Maybe you guys should go to another forum? Maybe you should reside at the VZW's forum site and jump on their bandwagon and praise their ToS?

We don't support those who cheat and steal data. We do understand the reason WHY some do it (price and cap). We don't support pirating. We've supported many different devs, and I'll bet my bottom dollar you've paid for such apps, simple donation, or anything else that goes against Verizon's ToS verbally.

You guys want to say more, then you know where VZW's site is. I'm gonna stay rooted and continue customizing my phone as I see fit. If they wish to do anything to my service, where it is no longer working correctly, then I will be more than happy to take both of our phones and personally shove it up VZW's where the sun don't shine. And then I will see them in court!

 

[pc747]

You cant blame tethering just on root users. I was tethering through easy root and pdanet long before I was rooted. In fact I tether less because wifi tethering is bad on battery life, and because I can oc my phone is a little faster. The primary reason is because of people sending in bricked devices. No one want to say, I damaged my phone I need to you my insurance here is 50 bucks. They rather say "my phone locked up".

 

[Dusty]

No one cares if Android is open except us. Android is still great, and will still continue to be great. It wasn't the D1's openness that made it a great phone like some people like to think. And it wasn't the rooting community that bought Motorola "from the brink" as others like to say.

Pretty much. The top 2-3 things that this community LOVES about Android aren't even things that Google, the carriers, or builders advertise or claim as a selling points. Like over clocking, ROMs, and system tweaking.

Here's my "thing"... What I don't like about the Android handset makers are the slipshod update deliveries and schedules, forced UIs, and bloatware. If they make these things unavoidable then there really isn't much keeping me here. What I like about Android is that these things (with minimal effort) are in my control more or less, and when combined with the naturally flexible experience of Android I found it perfect for me.

 

[cynnar]

It really peeves me that people like czerdrill and hookbill and others go against the argument of others and basically imply "well Verizon and Google are 100% right, we should abide by everything they say and pass on the word that rooting is wrong, customizing your phone is wrong, this and that is wrong and it's in the ToS!"

Kind of stupid you're implying that when the lot of you were and have been doing the exact same thing the rest of us have been doing for awhile. Which includes rooting, any form of customizing, and stuff to improve our phone or battery life. You're on a forum that is and was built for hackers, improvisors, tips and tricks from others, and many other people in those categories. Heck, even the rescue squad relies in areas to, by ways of rooting and other stuff, rescue people's phone.

Maybe you guys should go to another forum? Maybe you should reside at the VZW's forum site and jump on their bandwagon and praise their ToS?

We don't support those who cheat and steal data. We do understand the reason WHY some do it (price and cap). We don't support pirating. We've supported many different devs, and I'll bet my bottom dollar you've paid for such apps, simple donation, or anything else that goes against Verizon's ToS verbally.

You guys want to say more, then you know where VZW's site is. I'm gonna stay rooted and continue customizing my phone as I see fit. If they wish to do anything to my service, where it is no longer working correctly, then I will be more than happy to take both of our phones and personally shove it up VZW's where the sun don't shine. And then I will see them in court!

You go man. But come on we all know, love, and support our devs. I'm just not going to go to jail for a freaking phone. I have a family yo support. Can't do it from jail.

Will vzw go that far who knows.

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[czerdrill]

It really peeves me that people like czerdrill and hookbill and others go against the argument of others and basically imply "well Verizon and Google are 100% right, we should abide by everything they say and pass on the word that rooting is wrong, customizing your phone is wrong, this and that is wrong and it's in the ToS!"

Kind of stupid you're implying that when the lot of you were and have been doing the exact same thing the rest of us have been doing for awhile. Which includes rooting, any form of customizing, and stuff to improve our phone or battery life. You're on a forum that is and was built for hackers, improvisors, tips and tricks from others, and many other people in those categories. Heck, even the rescue squad relies in areas to, by ways of rooting and other stuff, rescue people's phone.

Maybe you guys should go to another forum? Maybe you should reside at the VZW's forum site and jump on their bandwagon and praise their ToS?

We don't support those who cheat and steal data. We do understand the reason WHY some do it (price and cap). We don't support pirating. We've supported many different devs, and I'll bet my bottom dollar you've paid for such apps, simple donation, or anything else that goes against Verizon's ToS verbally.

You guys want to say more, then you know where VZW's site is. I'm gonna stay rooted and continue customizing my phone as I see fit. If they wish to do anything to my service, where it is no longer working correctly, then I will be more than happy to take both of our phones and personally shove it up VZW's where the sun don't shine. And then I will see them in court!

again, your emotional arguments are irrelevant. i think is completely sucks that they might attempt to block rooting, i think its highway robbery that you have to pay $20 for tethering, i also think paying $30/month for unlimited data sucks for me because i'm on wifi 99% of the time, and can't wait for tiered plans. but i'm not going to get all emotional about it, like you and others do, because i agreed to the terms.

you're mixing up legality with what you think is right. you're getting emotional about the subject because you think its wrong. but yet you agreed to it. that's why you guys end up looking foolish. because you'll swear up and down how evil verizon is, and then a month later you'll start a thread called "anyone root the (insert newly released phone name here)??!!!"

if you truly believe that you're being ripped off then leave verizon. they can't force you to stay with them. but if you do stay with them, you have to abide by their rules. if you disagree with their rules, then take it to court and try to win, instead of making threads threatening to take them to court.

yes i root, yes i've tethered on very rare occasions. the difference between you and me is if verizon comes to me and says "we need you to pay for the 1KB of tethering you did" i'd pay it. if they said "we need you to pay for the 0.5KB of tethering you did" i'd pay it. because i agreed not to tether in the agreement i signed, and they are simply enforcing what was agreed to.

leave verizon, sue them, bring it to the steps of the supreme court. just stop crying about it here. you will most probably not win if you take it to court, you absolutely will not win if you take it to droidforums.net.

 

[czerdrill]

You cant blame tethering just on root users. I was tethering through easy root and pdanet long before I was rooted. In fact I tether less because wifi tethering is bad on battery life, and because I can oc my phone is a little faster. The primary reason is because of people sending in bricked devices. No one want to say, I damaged my phone I need to you my insurance here is 50 bucks. They rather say "my phone locked up".

well yeah i'm sure there are people out there tethering without rooting, but i think its a safe bet that most people who tether are also rooted. i can't imagine that the majority of tether-ers are unrooted...

 

[SquireSCA]

Some of you are really stubborn. Why do you think they have a ToS you sign for data usage? Have any of you saying "whatever whatever I do what I want" actually read any of the forms you signed for your phone? It's quite comical... Sure you're not going to get sued for tethering or rooting but they can deny you of service whenever the hell they want if you violate your contract. And if you take them to court for denying you of service you will probably get laughed at. They have you sign a contract for a reason.

And to those of you blindly following this article, I feel bad for you.

P3droid said the sky is falling tomorrow. Start praying!

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Why do they have that fine print in the ToS? To prevent people from sucking up 30GB a month.

Tethering has nothing to do with that.

You can spout about how if the ToS says that you cannot wipe your butt with your left hand, that we must abide by it, and I have pointed out where other companies tried that and lost.

When you bought a car, it said in the warranty provisions, IN WRITING, that YOU SIGNED FOR WHEN YOU BOUGHT THE CAR... that you had to have all service done at an authorized GM dealer and had to use genuine GM parts.

So the argument was the same, that "they knew when they signed the buyer's agreement", yada, yada, yada...

And people went back after the fact, fought it, and a federal law was passed that is still in effect to this day.

So yes, it may say that, and they can put whatever they want in there, and we as consumers have the right to complain, and if they continue to tighten the screws, some lawyer will want his 15 minutes of fame and will start a class action suit and the courts will get to decide if these practices are fair to the consumer or not.

It's happened before, and it is happening now, and the precendent has often sided with the consumers. Phone companies, cable providers, auto makers, Apple, and now VZW...

Time will tell which of us was right and which were wrong, but I think that history will repeat itself, again. Just my opinion...

 

[Backnblack]

When you bought a car, it said in the warranty provisions, IN WRITING, that YOU SIGNED FOR WHEN YOU BOUGHT THE CAR... that you had to have all service done at an authorized GM dealer and had to use genuine GM parts.

So the argument was the same, that "they knew when they signed the buyer's agreement", yada, yada, yada...

And people went back after the fact, fought it, and a federal law was passed that is still in effect to this day.

Apples and Oranges.... We are not talking about having the device fixed at a place other than a Moto Auth. Dealer. We are talking about using a service that you are not paying for.

 

[AdamPA1006]

It really peeves me that people like czerdrill and hookbill and others go against the argument of others and basically imply "well Verizon and Google are 100% right, we should abide by everything they say and pass on the word that rooting is wrong, customizing your phone is wrong, this and that is wrong and it's in the ToS!"

Kind of stupid you're implying that when the lot of you were and have been doing the exact same thing the rest of us have been doing for awhile. Which includes rooting, any form of customizing, and stuff to improve our phone or battery life. You're on a forum that is and was built for hackers, improvisors, tips and tricks from others, and many other people in those categories. Heck, even the rescue squad relies in areas to, by ways of rooting and other stuff, rescue people's phone.

Maybe you guys should go to another forum? Maybe you should reside at the VZW's forum site and jump on their bandwagon and praise their ToS?

We don't support those who cheat and steal data. We do understand the reason WHY some do it (price and cap). We don't support pirating. We've supported many different devs, and I'll bet my bottom dollar you've paid for such apps, simple donation, or anything else that goes against Verizon's ToS verbally.

You guys want to say more, then you know where VZW's site is. I'm gonna stay rooted and continue customizing my phone as I see fit. If they wish to do anything to my service, where it is no longer working correctly, then I will be more than happy to take both of our phones and personally shove it up VZW's where the sun don't shine. And then I will see them in court!

Great post. I have spent about an hour reading this thread and out of all the arguments i agree with yours the most

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